Re: (rshsdepot) Jim Guthrie's comments

["Paul S. Luchter" <luckyshow_@_mindspring.com>]

rshsdepot
#1) The NYC&N (NY&N) linked with the NY&NE to Boston I think (too lazy right
now to look it up)

2nd- I think what was meant by interline tickets on the Railroads mentioned
is before they were part of a larger entity (I am not sure exactly when the
Els became part of IRT, though I think by 1900 the NY El RR and the
Metropolitan El RR were already merged)...

What I am trying to babble out is that the NY Elevated RR and the
Metropolitan Elevated RR thought of themselves as true RRs, they even had
steam engines for a few decades. I think this is one reason sometimes you
see them have plans and maps to expand to NJ and upstate....obviously they
were not interstate, but I have no problems seeing them selling interline
tickets at all, since at first they did use tickets, why not- they had
connections with the NY and Hudson at that old station near 30th Street,
with the NY and Northern at 155th, at Grand Central via a spur on 42nd St.
(only the NY&Northern was on same platforms/tracks). They also had stations
near virtually every RR's ticket office (such as Erie and B&O) around
Manhattan, with exceptions such as the W 23rd St. Ferries...At first they
even carried freight. (At least I recall reading that), and didn't someone
even mention RPO early on?

So that would not be surprising. I have recently been reading old NY Times
on microfilm and came across when the IRT opened. It is quite striking how
even that subway was discussed as a railroad and nothing less.

As far as the H&M is concerned. It was a railroad and under the ICC, it
connected with all but the CNJ terminals on the Jersey side (OK, the West
Shore as well was missed) and RRs in Newark. Built before the subways (even
before the Boston one?) it was nothing but a RR. And it stopped a block from
Penn Station (though it was there first)...

Also it seems that Jim actually was witness to signs and stuff relating to
this at 9th Street. I don't doubt this was true, nor that it lasted until
PATH took over.

Anyone have any RR guides and if so were any of these three (The two El RRs
and the H&M) listed in it? Maybe there is mention there. (Or old NY&N
timetables? Or any RR that terminated on the other side of Hudson and might
see an advantage in promoting that they could also deliver passengers,
through connections, to close to Penn Station, so as to compete with PRR?)
It has ring of truth to it.

Paul


- -----Original Message-----
From: Seth Bramson <sbramson_@_bellsouth.net>
To: rshsdepot_@_lists.railfan.net <rshsdepot@lists.railfan.net>
Date: Saturday, March 03, 2001 10:19 PM
Subject: (rshsdepot) Jim Guthrie's comments


>rshsdepot
>Much of what Jim has written was new information for me and I am
>delighted to learn--as I do almost every day--on and from this list.
>However, I MUST question one or two comments and would appreciate
>clarification.  Where did you get the info, Jim, that major el stations
>sold interline tickets?  I have never seen or heard that before, and it
>just doesn't sound right.  Here's why:  my timetables back to pre 1900
>show the consolidated NY City and Bklyn ticket offices.  At no place
>have I ever seen anything regarding passengers buying through ticket
>(interline) at el stations.  It just doesn't sound right and I imagine
>Messrs. Delibert and Paul may have something to add on that.  As far as
>the comment that, "in theory, one could purchase an interline ticket
>from a booth at, say, 9th Street...."
>is not quite correct.  For many years, the PRR maintained a ticket
>office in the old Hudson Terminal Building(s) and I imagine that is what
>you might be thinking of.  I just don't think or believe that a transit
>clerk had the time or the wherewithal, in those small booths, to start
>selling interline tickets.
>
>One last item:  the through Boston Pullman that you state was a NY &
>Northern origination from the 155th St. el station:  I'm assuming you
>mean that the NY&N had
>a station at that point, do you not?  I just cannot picture a sleeping
>car being switched up to and on to the "el," so if you could clarify
>that it would be appreciated.  And my thanks in advance.
>

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