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Re: (erielack) Last Erie Passenger Train Derailment?
Thank you for sharing that. I grew up in PJ and I remember that being in the
local newspaper. Couldn't remember the exact date or train. I was about 12
years old at the time. The Times Herald Record of Middletown had extensive
coverage including an aerial photos. It brings back a lot of memories. My
father who worked for the EL police department was in one of the pictures
guarding the mail car. It was assignments like this and ceremonial functions
during which he would wear his uniform which was rare. That derailment
occurred , if I remember correctly, at "Rundle's Curve" just east of Black
Rock cut. That location became infamous in EL history with that derailment
followed by the 99 wreck at that location a couple years later and then the
side swipe of two trains after the 99 derailment which resulted in something
on the order of 100 cars derailing. It was after that the speed limit on
that curve was reduced to 30ty.
The 99 wreck resulted in four units and about 75 out of 90ty cars going on
the ground. My father was on duty that night and heard the crew frantically
calling "Yard B" that they were going on the ground then silence. My father
who was in the EL patrol car and entered the service road on the
right-of-way at what referred to as Tri-States in PJ and began driving east
bound. As he passed through Black Rock cut he could see the fire and smoke
from the derailed engines. Once he reached the wreck scene, he was able to
locate the crew and assist them into in patrol car. He headed back to Port
Jervis to the same St Francis Hospital as mentioned below. He was not able
to raise Yard B on the radio until he cleared Black Rock cut at which time
he told them to dispatch the PJ fire department. The next day he took me up
there with him and the level of destruction was unbelievable to a teenager
who was about 14-15 at that time. I still have the newspaper photographs
from that derailment even though they are showing their age at this point.
The official finding of the cause of the derailment was found to be
excessive speed. There was a lot of debate among railroaders for a long time
as to whether it was track structure failure or excessive speed. It was
foggy that night and the engineer might of lost track (no pun intended) of
exactly where he was. I was told, at that time, when a train started through
Otisville tunnel a bell would ring in the dispatchers office (on the bell)
and based on that I heard estimates of average speed on the order of as high
as seventy miles an hour between the tunnel and the location of the
derailment. When I worked for the EL in the late sixties and discussion of
that incident would come up there would people who would say that there was
no way that engineer involved would end up dumping that train on the ground.
It had to be track structure failure.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Jim McCormack
Sent: Monday, October 08, 2012 8:50 PM
To: Erielack_@_lists.railfan.net
Subject: Re: (erielack) Last Erie Passenger Train Derailment?
A few weeks back someone asked about the derailment of No. 7 near Port
Jervis on September 21, 1960. I had been on vacation and didn't get caught
up until now. I have some information about that derailment.
James McCormack, engineer of the derailed train, was my grandfather. I have
a number of documents from his files, including a letter from the Erie
(-Lackawanna by then) absolving him of responsibility for the accident. It
was determined that excessive speed was not the cause as had been initially
believed. I believe the final determination was that it was caused by poor
track conditions.
My grandfather's time ledger shows that he went on duty at 11:00 PM on 20
Sept 1960, but no off-duty time is noted. I know he went off duty at St.
Francis Hospital in Port Jervis, and he spent several weeks there.
Engines 823 and 822 led the train. They were later rebuilt, but from the
photographs I have of the wreck it's hard to imagine they would ever run
again.
I've searched the internet for information related to the derailment and
found little more than a brief article in the NY Times archive, which gives
almost the same information as given by the Buffalo Evening News. The ICC
Accident Report archive at USDOT does not contain a report on this accident.
Jim McCormack
On 9/18/2012 9:26 PM, Michael Connor wrote:
>
> IIRC there was a recent posting about Erie trains detouring over the DL&W
> prior to merger time. I was looking at a scrapbook (remember them) I
> assembled many, many years ago and found the following article, probably
> from the Buffalo Evening News, pasted in. This may explain some strange
> pre-merger sitings:"PASSENGER TRAIN DERAILED, 4 HURTPort Jervis, N.Y. Sept
> 21 [1960] AP -- The Erie Railroad's "Pacific Express" heading for Chicago
> with 15 passengers aboard, leaped the rails today on a sharp curve east of
> here. Three crewmen and one passenger were injured. Thirteen of
> the train's 14 cars were derailed. Some freight and mail cars overturned,
> but the two passenger coaches and one sleeper car remained upright. The
> wreck tore up 800 feet of the Erie's double-track right-of-way. One
> passenger said he was awakened by the rocking of ccars and the next thing
> he heard was that there had been a wreck. The injured included
> Engineer James McCormack, 62,of Hawtho!
rn!
> e, N.J. The other three were residents of Port Jervis."
> September 21, 1960, was a Wednesday so this was Train #7 leaving Hoboken
> at 12:45 AM and due at Port Jervis at 245 AM running via the Bergen
> Cut-off. This may have been the last passenger train derailment on
> the Erie Railroad.Hope this is of some interest to listers.MJC
>
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