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Re: (erielack) Youngstown (3)
Steve,
Thanks for the clarification, and certainly from the time you were there
when it was still an operating entity complete with the EL through downtown,
it's an unfornate skelton of its' former self.
But I still vividly remember looking forward to coming out to college in
Kent in the mid'70's, not just for the eduction that I got, but because this
was also Alco country, and to an Easterner at the time, Youngstown was gold
w/older units, ore trains, lots of track everywhere, and along with the rest
of Ohio, still alot of towers in operation at the time...Even though CR was
only a few months old when I arrived, it still looked EL w/all the RS2's/3's
and Century drilling about the yard - It was shortly after the
Cleveland-Youngstown trains were pulled off in January '77 that small
changes started taking place, and slowly operations faded as did the
once-thriving steel industry...
One of the more unique operations was at Center St., where the B&O main
crossed the NYC Youngstown Line,as well as where the P&LE interchanged w/the
EL, with a hugh Republic Steel mill shadowing over the interlocking...I
don't remember who had priority through there (I suspect the B&O) but
Youngstown Line trains had to proceed across the crossing based on hand
signals (lanterns/lights at night) from the operator, who was in small
shanty (hardly could be called an interlocking tower of any sort) to control
movements - it lasted 'till the late '80's/early '90's. It was a pretty neat
place to go to back then (and I still stop down there whenever I'm there...)
Thanks...
Rich
- ----- Original Message -----
From: <Smtimko_@_aol.com>
To: <erielack_@_lists.elhts.org>
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 9:56 PM
Subject: Fwd: (erielack) Youngstown (2)
> Rich
>
> You did a very nice job of spelling out what was left of the EL west of
> Hornell and through Youngstown. I was pondering how to explain it and you
> beat
> me to it and did a much better job. There are a couple of minor
> adjustments
> though, and it is only because it is such a bowl of spaghetti, so to
> speak....you really have to have lived with it to understand it
> fully..........it's
> very messy.
>
> WNYP is the owner of the line from Corry (MP S 60.50) to MEAD (MP S
> 102.30).
> Then WNYP leases the track from NS from MEAD S 102.30 to BK MP S 105.40)
> To further confuse that issue, the WNYP MP designations are SA instead of
> just
> S as the Erie used. (The WNYP also leases BK to Oil City from NS)
>
> The former EL line is abandoned and removed from just west of former
> Hubbard
> Interlocking (I believe CP Hubbard is gone now, but not certain). The
> Meadville Line swings over through the former EL Hubbard Yard Lead to the
> former
> NYC-PC Sharon Branch to CP-52 where it connects with the Youngstown
> Line..
>
> The Meadville Line connects with the Youngstown Line at CP-52, not CP-56.
>
> The Ohio Central operates from just west of Westlakes Crossing to a point
> west of Girard. They actually reinstalled about a mile of former EL main
> several years ago to serve Syro Steel (the plant west of Girard, not the
> Syro
> plant near Brier Hill). The Ohio Central interchanges with CSX at Ohio
> Jct.
> They interchange with NS at Haselton Yard in Youngstown using trackage
> rights
> from Girard to Haselton over the Lordstown Secondary Track (PRR) from
> Girard to
> former NK Target and then the Youngstown Line (NYC) to Center Street,
> continuing on the Youngstown Line (PRR) to Haselton.
>
> From west of Girard it is abandoned and removed as far as Belmont St
> Niles
> (MP 58.90). It is in service as the Ohio Central from Belmont Street
> west
> through Niles to about MP 57.50 (+/-). The OC serves a lumber company in
> Niles
> as well as the General Electric Lamp Plant and possibly one or two other
> industries just west of the GE plant. The Ohio Central accesses this
> Niles
> portion using trackage rights over NS from Girard to Niles on the
> Lordstown
> Secondary Track (PRR).
>
> The railroad scene in Youngstown is a ghost of the past.
>
> SMT
> <BR><BR><BR>**************************************<BR> AOL now offers free
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>
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> From: "Rich Behrendt" <rbehrendt_@_columbus.rr.com>
> To: "EL Mail List" <erielack_@_lists.elhts.org>
> References: <c6e.afdebb0.330f8ddf_@_aol.com>
> Subject: Re: (erielack) Youngstown (2)
> Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 21:07:26 -0500
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>
> Steve,
> The EL is intact from Binghamton westward to Hornell, Olean, Jamestown,
> Corry and Meadville (from Hornell to Corry owned by NS, but leased and
> operated by WNY&PA; and the portion from Corry to Meadville owned by the
> rail authority there (can't remember the name) but also operated by the
> WNY&PA).
>
> From Meadville west to Hubbard, the line is still in service as NS's
> Meadville Line.
>
> As Rick F. noted in an earlier email, the EL coming west out of Hubbard
> was
> connected to the NS ex-CR/PC/NYC Youngstown Line at CP 56, about 1-1.5
> miles
> west from the EL Hubbard station (which is still there today. The
> Youngstown
> Line handles mostly ore and coal traffic coming off the docks at Ashtabula
> Harbor heading south for Pittsburgh, and remains a busy line. Unlike the
> EL, the Youngstown Line skirted along the east side of the City, crossing
> the CSX ex-B&O main at Center St. (where the P&LE connected w/the EL at NK
> yard ) and heading south to Rochester where it connected w/the PRR main.
>
> The EL west of the connection at Hubbard into and through downtown
> Youngstown is gone. Effective with an agreement (which I happen to have
> a
> copy of) dated 7/8/83 between Youngstown and CR, CR donated the ROW
> (indicated as 21.24 acres total) to Youngstown for $1 from West Lakes
> Crossing (about .5-1 mile west of the station) eastward to Himrod Jct. (at
> Valley St. (tower) where the EL and the Youngstown Line crossed, and where
> the EL connection to the P&LE at Center St. diverged off)
>
> The sale of the EL ROW was done due to the number of older overhead
> bridges
> that were in need of replacement, as well as the City's desire to
> eliminate
> several grade crossings within the downtown area, plus the fact that the
> EL
> by the 1980's through Youngstown was no longer a through route for CR
> freight traffic. With the tracks gone, the bridges were removed and
> replaced with fill...
>
> From West Lakes crossing the track is in service and operated by Ohio
> Central westward through what's left of Brier Hill yard, Girard and into
> Niles (about where the old Niles station was). OC interchanges with CSX
> across the valley from Brier Hill at Ohio Jct., as well as with NS (I
> believe off their Lordstown Sec. at Niles) OC operates several other
> pieces
> of railroad in/around Youngstown, accessed via NS or CSX trackage
> rights...
>
> It's amazing how much railroad there was at one time in Youngstown, with
> the
> many connections and junctions that used to exist - but like the
> retrenchment of the steel industry, railroads also cut back as the big
> names
> in steel also left, leaving only remnants of a once-mighty industry in
> Youngstown...
>
> Rich Behrendt
> ELHS #384
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <STEVEZ10_@_aol.com>
> To: <erielack_@_lists.elhts.org>
> Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2007 7:22 PM
> Subject: Re: (erielack) Youngstown
>
>
>> Paul,
>>
>> Is it physically still possible to go an all ex-Erie routing from
>> Binghamton
>> to Youngstown, OH via the restored WNYP and then down to Youngstown???
>> Can
>> you still connect from Meadville to Youngstown or has that been
>> severed??
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Steve
>> <BR><BR><BR>**************************************<BR> AOL now offers
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>>
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