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Re: FW: (erielack) New book w/EL content
Some of this topic has been covered elsewhere at different times on this
list, but it's still pertinent, given the relevance to the Cleveland line.
Any realtor who thinks that having commuter rail will decrease property
values is, at the least, short sighted. One who bought that much ROW to keep
a railroad from building on it is going to hurt himself financially-and
deserves to be run out of the profession. As Paul's post attests, rail
service will increase property value. My mom lives two blocks from the LIRR
in Queens(I loved being that close to the trains, too-and you don't notice
after a while. I could sleep through any rush hour), and the houses in her
neighborhood go for quite a premium compared to houses a mile away. There
has always been added value to being closer to the train. Speaking as one
who has driven through Cleveland many times, I'd much rather take a train
into the city than have to drive there. This guy is an idiot. The car thief
commuter theory also doesn't hold up. Most of the people who would steal
cars probably can't afford the train fare to go to Warren(Warren?? To steal
cars??) anyway. Besides, why go all the way out there, when Shaker Heights
is much closer.
The question of eminent domain would come into play if ODOT or another
government agency were to acquire the ROW. Given the development over the
last several decades, this may pose a serious logistical problem, never mind
dealing with the NIMBY types. If the transit agency can show clear title to
the land, conveyed by the the EL estate, or by the state, whoever currently
has title-sometimes people build on an abandoned ROW, even though it's not
their property-they can force the "squatter" to remove whatever he built on
it. It gets ugly.
Ownership of the ROW depends on how it was assembled originally. In some
cases, the railroad bought the land outright, and it(or the estate) is the
owner, until it is sold to another party-even if the track was pulled up
years ago, and it hasn't been used since.
If the railroad got the ROW via an easement, the property may revert to the
original land owner, or his successors, once it has been abandoned by the
railroad. This will depend on the language in the easement. I had the chance
to follow the Erie ROW across Indiana a couple of years ago; much of it has
been plowed under in the rural areas, leading me to believe it was primarily
built on easements.
Tom B
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Riley" <wdperson_@_hotmail.com>
To: <secbyte_@_ptd.net>; <erielack@lists.railfan.net>
Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2002 9:33 AM
Subject: Re: FW: (erielack) New book w/EL content
> I agree with you. It should be an opportunity for the realtor. Not sure
if
> there is some under lying reason why the person feels this way. The other
> thing that is an issue is that the state of Ohio had talked about putting
> the tracks back down and running commuter trains from Cleveland to
> Youngstown. The town next door was against it because they felt that they
> would have an increase in crime. People come into town on the train get
off
> the train then steal cars and head back home. This was their reasoning.
> Maybe this is the same thought. I was thinking that emminet domain may be
> needed here to reclaim the ROW if they do indeed use the former EL line
for
> commuter service. When I heard the story of what he said I just rolled my
> eyes and said "I guess they like more cars on the road." Sorry, getting
off
> topic here.
>
> Mike Riley
>
> >Why would anyone.... Especially a Realtor who uses the railroad service
> >to attract customers to his area do this? The real estate folks in the
> >poconos have been pushing the railroads return as a reason to purchase
> >here for 10 years! It seems to me it is in the best interest of the real
> >estate folks to encourage rail return to their area. Look at Dover NJ
> >for example You just cant rent good living space in this town and I'd
> >bet the commuter opportunity has a lot to do with this.
> >
> >George
> >
> >Michael Riley wrote:
> > >
> > > on the former Cleveland line, Mahoning Div., First Sub Division, most
of
> >it
> > > has been turned back into private property. Some of it is an ATV
trail
> >as
> > > some people have used it for. One person made it a driveway to his
> >property
> > > and another business uses part of it as a truck entrance into their
> > > business. There is a realtor in my hometown that said he bought 5,000
> >acres
> > > of the former ROW on this line to make sure that the railroad never
> >comes
> > > through again. I didn't hear this myself, my parents did and told me
> >the
> > > story. Part of the ROW is a McDonald's also. I have also heard that
> >out on
> > > the west end (farther out as in Indiana) that most of it has been put
> >back
> > > into private property (i.e. corn fields? I think).
> > >
> > > Mike Riley
> > >
> > > >Walt Fles asked me:
> > > >
> > > > >It's interesting as to how much is let untouched after the
> >abandonment.
> > > >There are some sections that have been encroached upon, others that
> >still
> > > >have ties and ballast
> > > > >lying their in the weeds. A good section in Crown Point is
overgrown
> > > >with
> > > >trees and still has the signal poles intact. Is there come criteria
as
> >to
> > > >who can touch the former
> > > > >ROW and when/how?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >That's a darn good question! Does anyone know the answer to this? Who
> >owns
> > > >the land on the abandoned parts of the EL today?
> > > >
> > > > - Paul
> > >
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